Bangladesh Textile Today is very proud to present the following exclusive interview with Prof. Dr. Chokri Cherif, Director, Institute of Textile Machinery and High Performance Material Technology, Technical University of Dresden. Professor Cherif was visiting Bangladesh from 14th to 20th February 2010 on the occasion of the 2nd Alumni-Workshop (DAAD), which was held in College of Textile Technology, Dhaka. Having a long career of both academic and industrial background Prof. Cherif joined in Technical University of Dresden on 1st October 2005 as the Director of the Institute of Textile Machinery and High Performance Material Technology (ITM). In the conversation session we found Dr.Rolf-Dieter Hund, Head, Department of Textile Finishing,ITM, TU Dresden, Md. Kamruzzaman, Regional Head of Hohenstein Institute, Dr. Engr. Md. Humaun Kabir, Technical Editor, Bangladesh Textile Today (BTT) and Hosne Ara Begum, Assistant Professor, College of Textile Technology. The session was being chaired by Mr. Md. Monirul Islam, Editor in Chief, Bangladesh Textile Today. Editor and Publisher of BTT Mr. A.S.M Tareq Amin was also in the conversation meeting.
Mr. Monir:
You are here in the 2nd workshop of DAAD Alumni Association. What is the main focus of this program?
Prof. Cherif:
The first workshop took place in Dresden Germany two years ago. We have made decision to organize the second one out side Germany and it was very easy to select the right country Bangladesh. Why it is? Up to now firstly we have most people coming from Bangladesh but the second important point is we have very good experience with Bangladesh generally with the cost. And thirdly of course Bangladesh is very well known for its textile industry with very big progress. So we decided to take the opportunity to show the possibility of doing Masters and PhD in Germany, which is the main objective of the workshop.
And the program is from DAAD which means German Academic Exchange Service and they are spending lot in developing country in development of education and technology transfer. So this workshop is firstly financed by these organizations and they are looking for to be in the developing countries to discuss and see the possibilities of new project, that’s what we are also working on to find some subject for collaboration between Bangladesh and Germany and at the same time to look for some strategies for technology sharing.
Mr. Tareq:
So normally what type of collaboration you are looking for? Is it directly between governments or between any organizations like universities or others?
Prof. Cherif:
Firstly DAAD would like to transfer technology from Germany; second point is to see the level of institution or university. Our university, Technical University of Dresden for example is having four DAAD programs in different areas, which is the most number in Germany. Dresden University is the oldest in Dresden and the largest with 36000 students, about 6500 employees and 550 professors. We are looking for collaboration in all discipline. That is a strong situation for us, once we get students from abroad. We are sharing the resources of different departments as per the requirements. For example we (ITM) do use the facilities of chemistry, civil engineering, mechanical engineering etc. So that’s what we offer in our institute (ITM), all necessary facilities we have and also we grab other possibilities also.
One point we are interested to proceed with this program; the purpose of it to have best students, best bachelor graduates from abroad and we are interested to have more candidates in that direction. If you get more application surely we will get much more output from them. For Masters Degree & especially for PhD, it is very important to get best people. Up to now we have four people form Bangladesh in PhD which is the most number from any country other than Germany. In total 40 people are in PhD program and 10% is really a high percentage.
Mr. Kamrul:
And happily you may know that this year DAAD already selected two people from Bangladesh for Masters Program. This is the main thing DAAD is doing. Offering scholarship and also giving fund in textile education in Masters & PhD level. DAAD is looking for financing some projects. That’s what Mr. Cherif has told us to find out some subjects for that. He would like to take those with him and propose it to DAAD for a long time financing. The project could be running here in Bangladesh in collaboration with Dresden University.
Prof. Cherif:
So in fact what we need in this case is such kind of network. Studying Germany and if possible working with highly advanced projects like dealing with low atmospheric pressure technology which may be very useful technology. Finding out the right network is the first objective of DAAD and afterwards there are special programs financed by European Community. In this case who has the ability to offer and conduct such projects, may work with not only with German Institutes but also in collaboration with some companies. So at the end the target should be a network, and such kind of partnerships.
Mr. Tareq:
Can you make any example what type of project DAAD is doing?
Mr. Kamrul: He already explained it could be some research project like low pressure-temperature plasma coating technology and some other project which could be very interesting. Projects on environmental problem solution or may be we can find some project on alternative use of jute for technical textiles. And any other important and useful topic can be considered.
Prof. Cherif:
It also may be about new strategies of using much less chemicals and using environmentally friendly technologies. These will help in boosting export of Bangladesh. For example Oeko-Tex which means that no use of such chemical which is hazardous and ecologically not friendly. So what we need is having such kind of brands, unique things in order to enter much more in European and American market. It is very important to get new technology to use very modern procedures applied for manufacturing textiles and so you will get much better image. This better image is very important to enter in the new market. Not only the traditional and cheap products, you have to look into the next steps, what you will do in next ten years? I think its time to start because you have the market. For more sustainable future you have to build a new brand, Bangladesh brand with new technology.
Mr. Tareq:
And those projects will definitely help us to raise our level of products to high end more sophisticated from low end basic products.
Mr. Monir:
What do you think about the Bangladeshi students studying and going to study in ITM under DAAD.
Prof. Cherif:
Surely without any restriction and limitation we have very good experience with Bangladeshi students. We have students from more than twenty countries, and from DAAD scholarships we have every year six scholarships and nearly in all years most scholarships go to Bangladesh. May be they have done good application. Bangladeshis are constant and we have learned and experienced that is Bangladeshi people get the highest marks.
Dr. Humaun:
Do you select the scholarships on the basis of applications; is it like the more the applications the more the scholarships?
Prof. Cherif:
Yes some times it depends on the number of application. If much more students apply you will get more scholarships.
Mr. Kamrul: We have to focus this point, so that we can send more application from Bangladesh.
Prof. Cherif:
We have seen that the application is reducing. Normally DAAD has eight scholarships but we could give six scholarships. For that reason we want more applicants. Among these six scholarships never a less than two scholarships go to Bangladesh students and four other to other 19 countries. For Bangladeshi students we find that it is good invested money. So we ask more application and we hope that you will get more scholarships.
Mr. Monir:
You know that College of Textile Technology is being the first Textile University of South Asia. How do you evaluate the academic and course structure of the institute in the global perspective and how you will compare that with ITM?
Prof. Cherif:
In Germany there is no chance for German companies in garment manufacturing. They do marketing much more in Germany. The textile industry in Germany is much more focused to Technical Textiles and they are looking for textiles for automotive industry, special techniques to adopt with climate change and to get new solutions. In this case you have to know a lot more things other than textiles. You can not make textiles for automotive industry without knowing the car. For example air circulation, how to introduce such kind of facilities in the seats? So we are looking for new application area in building technologies and construction e.g.; membranes, insulating materials and also the concretes. In Germany we have a market of about 130 trillion Euros in Building construction. In every 100 Euro we have to do some strength reinforcement with steel which is a very large market. Traditionally they use steel rod with concrete and we are developing new technology which is carbon fiber based and with special concrete. In this case we have to work with civil engineering because that is where the technology will be used. With using steel, there are some disadvantages; oxidation of steel over the years. On the other hand we had to make thick walls which are costly. For that reason we can use carbon, which is non oxidative and a wall of only 3 or 4 millimeter is enough. We think that in future we are going to that direction and it is going to be a huge development.
Another big application of textiles is in light weight constructions. Up to now we use carbon structures in air craft industry. And you know in Boeing 787, more than fifty percent of the structure is made by carbon fiber, which is a textile. Thirty years ago that was a dream but now it is the practice. Now we are switching or trying to adopt such kind of technology in the car industry. That is another huge market for textile industry. Medical Textile is another sector, for example barrier against micro organism, strand based implant or braid structures, textile structures in leg etc. For these matters we have to cooperate with other disciplines. For us in Technical University of Dresden, there are 14 faculties. As we have faculty for medicine, electronics, biology etc. So depending on the application area we take help from each other. For most of the cases we are developing new technologies or machines for producing such products which are not available in the market. So we are concentrating on those areas also. From Institute of Textile Machinery and High Performance Materials we are doing construction of machines. We buy a loom but surely later on it will be completely modified. In this case we need to do collaboration with the textile machinery companies. Because we need such kind of interfaces in order to produce new module of machines that should communicate with the control of the machine. For that reason we need collaboration, otherwise we may solve the problem but with many difficulties. So we are doing development of machines, new procedure, new material and application research.
Mr. Monir:
Bangladesh is an important textile-garment manufacturing country. How can you see the challenges and opportunities of the country?
Prof. Cherif:
I think in Bangladesh now 80% of export is from textile industries. I can tell you that, it is very good thing today but at the same time it is such kind of dependency. What will happen if you have any conflict with USA for example? You will lose 40 percent of your export. So you need diversification, which is very important and also you have to enter new market. In entering new market you should have your own strategy in order to do wide spread export. Now-a-days you have good opportunity to open new market. But how to get there? Cheap products may be the good solution but that is not the best solution. The best thing to do is to have the infrastructure for new products. People should not think that I will buy from Bangladesh because that is cheap there rather they should think that it is quality also. You have to invest money in promotion; ‘Quality from Bangladesh’. You have to work hard on this topic. For that reason you need companies who are at very high level and they will work to enter this type of new market. I think here you need such kind of encouragement from the government but the same time you have to invest in universities and education. You are doing very well. As I know the export earnings from textiles is about 15 billion USD which is a huge amount and if you only spare 1% or may be 0.5% for research and development because that will be the future. You are spending today but if you don’t invest for future it will not be sustainable. May be market will drop. Investing today in education and research, like people having PhD afterwards join companies and then they try to come up with new ideas about the machinery and also they are not to accept every thing what they are practicing. On the other hand you have to go for new technology, trade fares and exhibitions. So for Bangladesh in a word has to invest in education-research, looking for new products and to establish Bangladeshi quality. You have good chance today. Nobody will provide you these opportunities in future because the market is shifting.
Mr. Tareq:
In garment area Bangladesh is producing very good quality product but still could not establish that; we can give quality. In global market may be people are coming to buy cheapest products but in some area we are producing very good quality products also. But really we have to promote ourselves.
Prof. Cherif:
Yes, promotion is the best. Sometime you may think that the money you are spending is giving no return but it come up with very good return. When you see your market in USA and Europe, sometimes you must go to the important conferences and important exhibitions to show your high quality products not only the standard quality. You can brand that you are in the position to provide quality but at low cost. Promotion is not a cost it is generating new market.
Mr. Monir:
Germany is the 2nd single largest importing country of Bangladeshi garment. What do you think about future prospect of Bangladeshi Garments in Germany?
Prof. Cherif:
It is the same the quality. For your country what you need, you should not stay at the bottom end but you should go to the higher end products and look for new markets in quality, which will give you opportunity to increase your share in Germany and also in whole Europe. Once people go to Turkey for example or in China, you will see companies who are very modern and working with the best companies in Europe. So people keep in there mind that they have very modern industries, when they have such kind of requirements they think that they produce quality.
Mr. Kamrul: For the basic garments even in the recession our export was not going down. China, Turkey and some other textile producing countries, they just get released themselves from the basic items of clothing; they are approaching to the high end products. So what we need to do, we have to look to factors and surely once we also have to leave the basic portion for example to the Africa and some other countries. As I am dealing with machinery in one part of my business, I am conscious that some of my machine suppliers are exporting machine to countries like Sierra Leone, Burkina Faso, Benin and also Egypt. In countries like Sierra Leone and Sudan the labor cost is as same as Bangladesh. So what we need to do is the branding of Bangladesh and to show the customers that Bangladesh is a cheap country by basic clothing and at the same time they have some research & development to give quality at a lower cost. Particularly in the fashion industry, I will tell you honestly that we are far behind in compared to Thailand, Malaysia and other countries.
Dr. Humaun: In Bangladesh the problem is we are not getting any support from government. Government is far away from research and development and even they are not providing basic need like utility.
Prof. Cherif:
You also need very strong associations with good link to the policy makers. That is very important. You do not know, we invest a lot of money in order to have linkage to the government to get new programs and financing in research and development. People have a lot of problems to solve.
Mr. Monir:
How do you see the prospect of German machines in a recession hit economy in the coming years? And also you know that you are offering price in Euro which is not that stable in compared to USD.
Prof. Cherif:
It is realistic to have such kind of conversation with big companies in Europe. The big companies are investing in India, China. I know that the cost of exporting is rising every year. Every year salary has to be increased along with most other costs. You are in such region where there is very good chance for the companies to invest here. So looking to these holes in direction, I think it is realistic. But at the end you need the modern machineries. For convincing the decision makers who see what kind of machinery you are using, some times other machinery may give quality but they will tell that the machines are not the modern one. Current situation is very promising here. What we need to have a strong team to link with the decision makers, quality and modern machinery.
Mr. Tareq:
So do you see any prospect for machinery companies to come over here with there manufacturing facilities?
Every company is for making money. They are looking for market and to produce machinery at a very low cost. Twenty years ago the machine was sold to USA for example but that have shifted to Asia. But really it was not an easy decision to build the manufacturing facility in Asia. It took lot of time. But at the end you see the turn over is dropping. There was no profit so they had to go there. What is happening in last five or seven years, all big companies are existing in India and China. It was really very tough decision to take. But if at the end the figures for the company are OK they will come. Here in Bangladesh also they have to investigate the whole situation. I think from Bangladesh if you export to India, China, and Pakistan you have to pay tax. These should be exempted. And after that you can discuss with every company because they are looking for profit and they have no problems to come if they get money here.
Mr. Tareq
In the machinery industry, before five to seven years there was a big brand loyalty but now the Chinese and Indian machines are coming with copies at a half or sometimes lower than that price. So what are the challenges of German machinery in this regard?
Once you buy copies for example in Bangladesh the machinery companies have to do patents in Bangladesh. If they do so here in Bangladesh and some companies buy copy of that machine from China, the patent bearer can stop it. In this case you have to look for good environment for the investor. It is highly complicated situation; it depends on political situation between the countries also.
Mr. Monir:
Thanks Prof. Cherif for your valuable time. Thanks to Prof. Hund and Mr. Kamrul also for being with us.
